Re: Novell buys Ximian

[Robert Threet <rthreet@yahoo.com>]

--- bob@evilkat.com wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 20, 2003 at 06:41:40AM -0700, Robert Threet wrote:
[snip]
> > And yeah, the "weird idea to stop developement of gnome" has crossed my mind.  I'm not saying
> > I buy it. It is strange, though. "Why buy a cow when milk's free"?  Novell seems to be saying
> > "Here's some free milk.  If you do buy a cow - buy ours."  Linux is undercutting their product
> > line too.  Firewalls and Squid Proxy eliminate the need for Bordermanager (for the most part).
> > SAMBA eliminates the need to buy print and file share.  OpenLDAP...  Portals...  The Novell
> > angle is a strange one.
> 
> I think you've hit the nail on the head or really close, they aren't providing
> the cow (thats linus and gnu that have the cow to give away), they have a 
> pasturizing machine and for a small fee they will process and pasturize your
> milk to make it taste better and last longer (it's an analogy :), this is
> key to the success of thier linux idea, it's the exact same idea that ximian
> had, ok so you use linux and you can download evolution but you want some 
> support and neat features (like connecting with exchange) then pay us a little
> and here you go, novell brings some really nice things to the table, you can
> use samba or any number of other file sharing server processes but your still 
> stuck with the unix rights system (anyone that has worked with novell
> probably misses the granularity of control they had on the file level coming
> to unix, i know i do), NDS is IMHO hands down the best implementation of an
> ldap/x.500 directory i've ever seen, i would love to have my single sign on
> with sessions so i don't have to log in over and over again, 

[quick aside] I use SunOne's directory now.  One of the things that struck me was the incredible
lack of tools (like dsrepair, etc.) for directory health.  Still, NDS needs this - so far
[knocking on wood] SunOne hasn't.

> and if you can
> make squid and iptables so that it works like bordermanager please tell me
> how (i'm of course refering to the user logging in at some machine and squid
> just knowing it's that user so it knows which areas of the internet they are
> allowed, not by machine and not by making the user re-login to the proxy), and
> yes i've heard of people duck taping and super glueing things together to come
> up with a single sign on but as soon as the new versions of ldap and other 
> pieces come down the pipe all the sudden your ripping apart this kludge to
> get it working again, right now there is no easy answer for these things but
> if by chance novell does things right there is no doubt in my mind that linux
> could sweep large corporate installations with the ease of administration even
> a MCSE admin could appreciate, this is a dream come true for me but if it's
> not handled right it could turn into a nightmare :(  
> 

Well, BorderManager is no piece of cake either.  True, most of the solutions require some work and
experience.  But the potential is there.  Potential to be robbed of their market in the future. 
Still, who knows.  There will always be a certain percentage (perhaps large percentage) of the
market that simply won't feel comfortable using a product without some large corporation "to be
held responsible if something goes wrong."  And, maybe, Novell is genuine in their goals.  It will
be interesting to see how it plays out.  It's looking very positive for Novell and Linux.

=====
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